AgriCulture Live Podcast Transcript - Episode 19

Rebekah 00:01

Hello and welcome to AgriCulture Live. My name's Rebekah Shields. I'm one of the directors of Agricultural Recruitment Specialists. You don't want to go anywhere. You don't want to miss this. It's a great episode. We're going to be looking at why veterans are a perfect fit for a career in agriculture. If you've got any questions or comments, please post them in the chat box and we'll get to them when we can. So over to you. Dawn, would you like to introduce yourself and where you work.

Dawn 00:31

Yes, Rebekah, so morning. I'm Dawn Turner. I'm the CEO and founder of Stepway. I have a background in nursing and a criminology degree, and I'm a proud mother of two serving soldiers. One is now a veteran.

Rebekah 00:49

Fantastic. So how do you define a veteran? Because obviously I'm not. I'm not a military person, so you have to explain it to me.

Dawn 00:57

So just for people, in case they don't know what is a veteran yeah, it's very confusing for some because a veteran - people picture an old guy with a walking stick, with a row of medals turning up on Remembrance Day, and it isn't. It's anybody that served at least one day in the armed forces and has now left.

Rebekah 01:21

Right, ok, got you. So it's easier than saying ex-military, it's veterans.

Dawn 01:27

Yeah, I think. I think it's more of an American term. We used to say ex-forces and it's kind of like leaked into our society and now we call them veterans.

Rebekah 01:39

Fantastic. So tell us about what Stepway is for those that don't know.

Dawn 01:45

Yes, stepway is a military charity. We support all veterans and their family members, helping them to transition back into civilian life, but we also support those who are still serving and reservists, and we also support those that have been out for a very long time. And there's a lot of confusion over that as well, because they think that Stepway is here just for people have just recently left, and it's not the case. So we work with people from the age of 19 - early service leavers right up until well - I think our oldest one is in his 90s and he joins in with all the groups and everything. So, we focus mainly on mental health, welfare support, employability through our Seven Steps Civilian Skills Programme and many activities and groups that we put on too.

Rebekah 02:38

So it's all good work for veterans, so why did you start Stepway? What was the drive behind it?

Dawn 02:45

Yeah, so I've always worked with veterans and the armed forces. Being a mother of two serving soldiers, I've seen and worked with families that have got sons and daughters. Both my sons went to Harrogate the Army Foundation College. We met a lot of families and they all went to war either in Iraq or Afghanistan at the time, including my lads, and we kind of like prepared ourselves as much as possible because we knew that some weren't going to return, so we attended quite a few funerals. I felt quite guilty at the time because I still got my two lads and some family members sadly didn't. But what I didn't prepare myself for was the many funerals due to suicide after that become quite a shock and due to personal experience back in 2015, when I was nursing at the QE.

03:51

I received a call to say that my sister had taken her own life and, yeah, it just sent me into a bit of a spiral. So, I left nursing. I went back to university to study criminology, purely to build a rehabilitation program for veterans in prison. But in my last year I lost my brother to alcohol addiction and my own son's mental health hit the all-time low and he attempted to take his own life. I reached out and there was a long waiting list of six months and we were on suicide watch with him and it just wasn't good enough.

04:29

So, I decided I wanted to build a rehabilitation program which was going to be more universal so I could cover all veterans and family members in civilian life, no matter their background or circumstance. So that's how the Seven Steps Civilian Skills Program was born in civilian life, no matter their background or circumstance. So that's how the Seven Steps Civilian Skills Programme was born and how I was going to deliver it was that I tried to find a little place and I found a little coffee room at the Salvation Army in Worcester who gave it to me free for a little drop-in centre and it grew from there and that's where I was going to stop. And then suddenly we had a wellbeing centre and then it just went on from there.

05:14

So, to date we've got two wellbeing centres. We've just taken over Link Nurseries in Perwick in Worcester, which is promoting inclusive communities, breaking down those barriers between veterans and civilians, because a lot of people forget that it's not just the veteran, it's the family member too. So, you know we could support the family member but we had difficulty referring them because it was very veteran, focused in most of these military charities. So, we had to tap in to the civilian side and a place we had to find a place to do so, and so link nurseries is absolutely fantastic. We've got the facilities here and, yeah, supporting people going forward.

Rebekah 05:58

It's amazing because you haven't sat in a problem, you've got into a solution and created something positive out of you know heartache, which is admirable really, Dawn, so well done to you. But yeah, so I take it that Mental health is like massive with veterans. Is it a big deal? A lot of people suffer?

Dawn 06:23

I think you know saying that all veterans suffer from mental health is untrue. There's a minority of veterans that do suffer mainly from adjustment disorder, survivor's guilt, PTSD tends to be thrown around quite a lot. In saying that you know, people vision that all veterans have got PTSD and they're, all you know, struggling and they can't work. And you know it's further from the truth. I mean, you know there is a few that are struggling, but things can be put in place to make it easier.

Rebekah 07:01

Fantastic, okay, so tell us then about everything that stepway offers?

Dawn 07:07

Okay, so our services, the seven step civilian skills program which I mentioned before, is based all around mental health awareness, the survival kit.

07:24

It leads on to healthy body, healthy mind, and then we break down those barriers to employment and education. And this is when we tap into you, guys, for support.

07:37

And then we've got the banter and brews. So the banter and brews. Originally there was the drop-in centre but it sounded a bit welfare-ish and it turned a lot of people away because it was like I haven't got a problem, I don't need to turn up to this, um. But as soon as we renamed it banter and brew and threw a free breakfast in everybody, everybody turned up. Like you know, we had an influx of veterans and family members. It was great. So those banter and brews are all over the west Midlands and Worcestershire.

08:04

We've got the community projects, which is the last kind of like step, which is breaking down those barriers between veterans and civilians, so everyone joins in. We've got the beekeeping project, the mushroom farm, the allotments, archery, foraging, bushcraft, you name it. It just keeps growing. And I mentioned about the well-being centres and we do this, the mental health support and the well-being support there. And the link community hub is bringing everybody together and providing and delivering those courses and groups on a bigger scale for a bigger cohort. And we've also got the prison in reach program. So, we got there eventually. Well, I got there eventually. So, we work in six prisons. We attend the veterans forums. We are now four members of COBSIO within the justice cluster, so we work along the sides of Op, nova, care, after Combat, safa and yeah. So we're all joining forces in making that transition out of prison and back into civilian life a lot smoother, but also supporting the family members on the outside. So we're building a supportive network to reduce reoffending.

Rebekah 09:25

There's something for everyone.

Dawn 09:26

There is there yeah well, we keep finding missing gaps in provision and we kind of like jumping with two feet and then yeah. So it's a little bit crazy, but we've got a great team.

Rebekah 09:37

It's crazy, really, because, as a civilian, as I, would be classed as yeah, you know you think, thank God, there's people that are willing to go and fight for us to protect the country and everything, but we don't think about what happens to them after really do we no? So why do you think you know people listening? Why should we support veterans more?

Dawn 09:59

Well, I think veterans I mean they've served their country. You serve, you deserve. That's it in a nutshell. You know, and with their commitment and bravery that they've put in, you know we all have the responsibility to support those people, as they supported us and they fought for our freedom. Supporting them is all about recognizing their value, ensuring they have the tools they need to thrive after service, because they don't want to ask for help because it's a sign of weakness and they've been trained not to show a sign of weakness. You know.

10:39

So, if you noticed, in all our literature we don't use the word help, we always use the word support. And how I explain it to veterans that come along and say, no, we don't take charity, we don't, we don't want to ask for help, we don't need help. And we say well, we're not going to help you. You know we're going to support you. Now, when you're in the armed forces, you sometimes need to call in for air support, for instance, to be able to move forward and complete your mission. And it's exactly the same in civilian life. You need that little bit of support to be able to move forward and complete your mission, and that's what we're here for.

Rebekah 11:22

Absolutely so. We're working in partnership. Together. We recently signed the Armed Forces Covenant, which was great, with your support. Why do you think linking it back to ourselves? Why do you think veterans could be good for agriculture jobs?

Dawn 11:40

Oh, that'd be amazing. Be amazing seriously. Because you've got military roles like mechanics, logistics officers, engineers share many skills with the agricultural jobs you've got.

Dawn 11:52

Veterans are trained in problem solving, leadership and working under pressure, which are highly transferable skills. I mean we, we have had success with a lot of our where we've had skill shortages, like with agricultural engineers.

Rebekah 12:03

I mean we, we have had success with a lot of our where we've had skill shortages, like with agricultural engineers. Yeah, where we've placed veterans because people are more open to that and they've had amazing success, both the veteran and the company, in terms of you know the benefits of having a veteran in the business. Um, we found that, you know, we found it's worked. But what do you think are the transferable common military roles and skills that prospective employers could use?

Dawn 12:36

Okay. So, they need to be looking at the transferable skills. I mean you've got military skills like teamwork, which is the main one I know for a personal experience. I mean, our trustee board is veteran-led and most of our volunteers and staff members are veterans because they get the job done and it's great. You only have to tell them once, ask them once and they get the job done, you know? So, I've ended up this military mind now that I think everybody's the same and when they're not, it's like, oh right, okay, I can understand your frustration. When it comes to civilian life, yes, so, yeah. So teamwork is a big one - team management, attention to detail, and they can easily adapt to civilian roles. For example, logistics officer in the army can manage the supply chains in agricultural industry. So, yeah, there's a lot out there that we just need to look a little bit deeper. That we just need to look a little bit deeper because a lot of these veterans that come out actually don't know how to transfer their skills onto a CV.

Rebekah 13:49

And timekeeping is usually a big one, isn't it?

Dawn 13:52

Oh gosh, yeah, If you say be there at 10 o'clock, they're probably there for about 9.30.

Rebekah13:57

Yeah.

Dawn 13:58

And then you're there at 10 o'clock and they'll want to know why you're late.

Rebekah 14:09

So how can military skills translate to civilian life?

Dawn 14:11

I've said there's a lot. The example I gave you about the logistics officer in the army can manage the supply chains in your industry. There's a lot of different skills, but I know there's a few places, including the lovely Claire from yourselves who actually builds up CVs and she has kindly said that she'll sit down with any veteran and have a look at their skill set and their qualifications that they've gained in the armed forces and transfer them into a civilian talk, maybe, yes, um onto a CV to help them gain employment. So yeah, it's just worth asking the question.

Rebekah 15:05

Absolutely so. What are the main challenges that veterans face during transition, so that recruiters can be aware and employers can be aware? What are they?

Dawn 15:16

I think it's finding suitable employment, the main one, because I know that quite a few of the guys and girls that come our way, they've bounced from job to job because they have got that set of skills but again they haven't been able to transfer them into civilian life. So when they go for a job interview they think, oh, they're not really qualified to do this job, so they'll offer them a job in a lower position and it's boring. It's boring for them and you just can't retain their attention. It's like when you're in the army you've got this sense of purpose and you've got this sense of belonging and you've also got that buzz, you know, because you build up all that adrenaline to go out and do what you need to do. And you can get rid of all that adrenaline in, I don't know, a job in a factory. Um, you know, in a warehouse.

Rebekah 16:16

You know it's very, very repetitive yeah, and you've got to consider Dawn as well that veterans they have been in the forces because they love learning new skills.

Dawn 16:27

They do, they do, and I mean you know absolutely.

Rebekah 16:31

They are sponges really aren't they?

Dawn 16:33

They are. They are and, as I said, you know, with adapting to a less structured civilian life as I'm going back to the armed forces culture you are in like a safe bubble. Everything is done for you. You know you get your three meals a day, your bills are paid and whatever's left is yours. So you know some of the bills that you have to pay when you come out of the army is a bit of a shock. You know you've got to take responsibility for this and responsibility for that.

17:03

And then if you've got civilians that are not actually working on the same page and they're maybe 10 minutes late or a little bit oh, I'll do that a bit later or you know, it can be quite upsetting. You know, trying to adapt into that place because they just miss that whole armed forces culture and managing mental health and issues like PTSD. Now, as I said before, you know, not every veteran is suffering from mental health, you know. But you do get the odd few that are. It's just recognizing that and being able to signpost them to the, the appropriate people that can support them through and so they can retain their job role okay.

Rebekah 17:58

So you're an employer. You found the veteran. That's perfect for a job, whether, whether it's engineering, logistics, supply chain, whatever it may be okay. How do you support them when they come into your workplace?

Dawn 18:11

Okay. So supporting them is recognising that their military experience is valuable.

18:18

So you don't put that aside and say you've been in the army, great, you know, but you haven't got any formal qualifications. But actually they're probably more experienced than a lot of people. That's already in place, like you know. So, um, offering training to fill the gaps, because they are. They are keen to learn, as you said, Rebekah, they're very keen on learning new things, so they'll grab that with two hands, and I have got personal experience with this as well.

18:48

You know, we will send a list out of free courses that month and you bet your bottom dollar they sign up to every one because they're just so interested. They're like sponges, they like to absorb things and just be patient and open-minded about the transition process. So if they, if they are having a little bit of a meltdown and this is too much and I don't want to do this no more, and I want to work walk out, just sit down and just have a chat with them and maybe put them in touch with us because we, we can support them whilst they're in their, their job role and so if you, you know as an employer, wanted to take on a veteran, I know they're very attractive to a lot of companies because of their skill sets and everything.

Rebekah 19:32

Where do people go about finding them?

Dawn 19:37

What should they do? Right, okay, for finding them.

Rebekah 19:45

So yeah, for a vacancy they've got. How can they find them to fill these vacancies?

Dawn 19:49

Oh right, okay, so that there's a lot of um different platforms. So, you've got family forces employment support, that's for the family members. You've got employment support agencies. They've gone out of my head actually. Rebekah, I'm just trying to think now.

20:11

But yes, I know we've talked about it before you know opening up job adverts saying that you'll consider, you know, veterans oh, I see where you're coming from now, yeah so yeah, on your um, on your job description, always put that you know if you meet the minimum requirement, that you'll always be offered an interview if you're a veteran armed forces reservist. Yeah because a lot will read through and go, no, I've got that, I've got that, that's it, I'm not buying yes, yes, yeah. So if you keep it quite open and friendly and inviting, yes, and training provided, that's a big one excellent thing.

Rebekah 21:02

So, in terms of employees, what can they do to support veterans more in the workplace?

Dawn 21:12

I think, providing mentoring, peer support. So if you've got somebody already in place that's a veteran, it's good to start up like a buddy system. So it's nothing like talking to somebody that's walked the walk, so it's like for like, isn't it? You know it's it's like us, Rebekah, I mean, we've both got children and we wouldn't be able to explain to somebody that's not got children what it's like to have children. So it's very much like that with the veterans. Um, you know, someone that hasn't been, hasn't served, doesn’t necessarily know really what it's all about, yeah, and what it's like that culture unless they've lived it. Absolutely foster an inclusive environment. Now we're both Worcestershire inclusive leaders, uh, so that's big on our, big on our list anyway. But, yeah, just help break down those barriers and understanding within the workplace and promote mental health awareness and offer flexibility where needed.

Rebekah 22:22

So I mean, we know that mental health awareness it's, it's, it's not just veterans, you know it's a massive thing, mental health it is important for employers to consider that, isn't it?

Dawn 22:36

Yeah, and it's having that flexibility as well, you know. So you, you get your sick days. You know somebody might ring in and say, oh, you know, I've got, I've got a stinking cold. I can't turn up today and that's accepted. But when they call and say I need a mental health day, not a lot of people kind of can get their heads around that and they're like oh, suck it up and come in.

23:01

You know, yeah, yeah, but we do really need to concentrate on that, because mental health affects physical health, as you know, so you know, if it keeps bubbling along under the surface it will turn out physical and they'll be off for months. So yeah, offer that flexibility when needed.

Rebekah 23:20

Dawn you do a fantastic job. How can people donate or help your charity?

Dawn 23:27

We're always asking for help as a charity.

Rebekah 23:32

All charities are struggling at the moment, aren't they?

Dawn 23:37

Yeah, it's a real struggle. I mean, when we first started, covid hit literally about a month after we started. So, it was it was yeah, it was interesting, you know, but that's how the community projects were born, because we still had to meet our veterans in a safe, open place, so yeah, so that's how they were born. So they probably wouldn't have come about if it wasn't for covid.

24:03

So, there is pluses yeah but now, with the present climate, I mean, yeah, everyone is struggling, every charity is struggling and it is a very stressful time. So, um, we always ask you know if you can donate, volunteer fundraise for us? We had a recent one from rooftop housing and they went for a walk from their Worcester office to Evesham and they raised over a thousand pound and it was called Steps for Stepway - Absolutely fantastic. So if I can encourage other organisations to get on board or companies that like to get involved, brilliant. And you can, of like, just visit our website and see about all our details and how you can get involved. And that's at - down the bottom, it's running along, so I don't need to repeat it again. But, yeah, but, thank you so much for having me. Oh, thank you. I mean.

Rebekah 25:02

It's been a pleasure. If you are a veteran listening with transferable skills, please contact us at agricultural recruitment specialists, which is www.agriRS.com where one of our team will be happy to help you. Or if you'd like to find out more on stepway, please visit www.stepway.org What a great discussion Dawn. As you've explained, it's really important you know that organisations consider veterans as potential employees, as there's huge benefits there for both. It was great to have your input today. I do appreciate it. So thank you everyone for watching and listening. Keep following us at Agricultural Recruitment Specialists. We've got some great new discussions coming up in the new year. If you would like to be on the show, if you've got a great topic we could discuss, please get in contact with me via our website, and if you would like to hear more on new issues and topics within the agricultural and farming industry, you can follow us on various channels, including Spotify, YouTube, apple podcasts just look up AgriCulture live. So that's it from me, Dawn. Would you like to say goodbye?

Dawn 26:21

Yes, thank you for listening everyone and hope to catch up with you soon. Thank you, take care bye.